Blizzard Blues: Expansion Beta, PVP Deaths

Info on many topics including dyes for legendaries, and PVP with Elite item bonuses

Apart from the large story of Jay Wilson leaving Diablo III, and Rob Pardo providing thoughts on the topic, work still continues on Diablo III patch 1.0.7. Here are some of the many recent posts by the Blizzard blue posters on the forums, and other places.

While just confirming what we already knew, it's always nice to see it stated explicitly: Rob Pardo put out a tweet, stating that the first Diablo III expansion, and the Blizzard All-Stars game, will have standard beta testing.

The Diablo III expansion is being worked on, and we'll likely hear official details about it later this year.

Some of the topics recently discussed in Blizzard blue posts include problems with the PVP dueling system on the PTR, allowing dyes to work on legendary items, and allowing affixes against Elites like the Stone of Jordan to work against player characters.

Update: See the Patch 1.0.7 Guide for all the patch 1.0.7 info!

In a current bug with dueling on the PTR, a character can die after leaving the dueling area, with a DoT still active. This will be fixed in the next PTR patch.
Hey guys,

Thanks for the reports. In the next PTR patch (no ETA at this time), your hero will be fully healed and have all debuffs cleared from him when you leave the dueling area.

The new Rare crafted items have some steep component costs, given the stats that can roll on the items. The developers are keeping an eye on that, and the crafting costs may be reduced.
We've been keeping an eye on feedback regarding the resource cost for these new recipes, and making adjustments is certainly still on the table. Posting your results for those of you that have done some testing with the new recipes is helpful, so we encourage you to do so.

Thank you all for your feedback while we are doing this PTR testing, we have been working to ensure your thoughts and concerns are finding their way to the developers so keep it up!

Items such as the Stone of Jordan increase damage against Elites. Other characters in PVP are supposed to be considered Elite, but due to a bug on the PTR that is currently not happening. A discussion dealt with what it means, to have equipment like this that adds extra damage against player characters.
Players are intended to be Elite, but after some investigation (thanks to your reports) we were able to determine that this isn't happening on the current build of the PTR. That's absolutely a bug and we'll be fixing it for a future PTR build.

Once the bug is addressed, this is what you can expect:

1. +Damage vs. Elites and +Reduced Damage from Elites affixes on items should work correctly against players.

2. The CC reduction rules that apply to Elite monsters in Inferno should also apply against players. Much like Elite monsters in Inferno, players will cap out at 65% CC reduction (with CC effects less than 0.5 seconds being ignored). These values are subject to change or go through different iterations as the PTR continues.

3. There is also an inherent 30% CC reduction in player vs. player which is not currently working on the PTR. So, a 4 second stun should only last 2.8 seconds in PvP combat. This can, of course, be combined with CC reduction from gear and skills.

(Note that pets are not currently considered Elite.)
Posted by: EnZ

So with this addition everyone who does PvP will be required to wear a SOJ. Its not an option once you add in players being elites. 30% damage to elites, yep

We think there's merit to the concern that SoJs will be considered mandatory by serious duelers once the fix goes live. At the same time, we also feel that being able to directly translate how CC and Elite-specific affixes work in PvE to PvP is a huge benefit for players, and outweighs the potential issues with SoJ. We're going to see how things play out on the PTR.

Posted by: Onetwo

Ooh nice Lylirra. The only downside will be SOJ's importance for PvP, though one could say this actually helps lead to more item variety choices since people will be picking out those affixes rather than using their farming gear or PURE defensive builds.

We'll be monitoring player feedback very closely after the fix goes live, and how the Stone of Jordan plays into builds (and dueling as a whole) will definitely be a detail we pay attention to. This is why PTRs are awesome, and we hope that players are willing to share their experiences with us.

It was confirmed that with patch 1.0.7, a Hellfire Ring will salvage into regular legendary materials. They will not salvage into Hellfire Ring components, for the reasons listed.
Posted by: Ryce

Will you get a brim or organ in 1.07 if you salvage ur hellfire rings?

The plan is to have Hellfire Rings salvage into normal Legendary crafting materials in 1.0.7 (not organs, see below). That change isn't live on the PTR right now, but will be in a future build.

Here's an earlier response I provided on the topic of Hellfire Rings > demonic organs. The reasoning still holds true:

Posted by: Lylirra

We've definitely discussed the possibility of allowing Hellfire Rings to salvage into component pieces, and have debated your feedback quite heavily as a part of that process. While we understand why players would like Hellfire Rings to salvage into demonic organs (or even Keywarden keys), we don't think that's the right way to go right now since it would essentially let you skip some encounters completely. It's something we may revisit in the future, though, once the event has been around for a longer period of time.

The legendary items in Diablo III currently can not have their colors changed via dyes, like other items can. This is something that the artists for the game would like to fix, but it is a long process. For patch 1.0.7, there will be a change to so that Vanishing Dyes will work on legendaries. Using a Vanishing Dye removes the image of the item entirely, so players will not have to see items with models that they don't like.
We’re working on getting Vanishing Dyes for Legendary items into 1.0.7. We intend for them to have the same slot restrictions as dyes traditionally have, so you’ll be able to use Vanishing Dye on say, your Legendary shoulders or helmet, but not items such as your weapons.

We hope this change will be available for testing on the PTR in a future build, but that may not possible. We’ll keep you updated. :)
Posted by: Fearophobias

Nice - applies to COLOUR DIES TOO PLEASE

I'm sure adding color to every legendary skin would take time. Vanishing dye at least would be a lot easier to do which is why it would be able to make it into 1.07. They will do color in the long run though I'm sure.

We’re definitely working on making all dyes work for Legendary items. It’s not a quick-fix, though; as Fearophobias surmised, our artists actually need to go back and redo the textures on all the Legendaries in order to make them dye-compatible.

Since we know this process will take some time, we wanted to make sure that players could at least use Vanishing Dye for now (it was the most-requested dye for Legendaries that we’ve seen to date).

A long discussion about how characters often die from just one hit in PVP right now, brought responses from Lylirra. This is just the first taste of PVP in Diablo III, and the developers are keeping an eye on how it all shakes out. There may be across the board damage reductions in PVP or other methods added, to make PVP interesting for a long-term perspective.
We implemented dueling to provide interested players a way to battle each other -- no objectives, no scoring, just Nephalem against Nephalem. It was something the community has been asking for, and with additional PvP modes still in development we honestly didn't have a good reason to keep saying no.

Dueling isn't intended to be balanced, though, so don't expect a fair fight. That's not what dueling is about. There will probably be some match-ups in which you're one-shotted (this is a big reason why we have no permanent Hardcore deaths at the moment). There will also probably be some match-ups in which you one-shot other players. Your heroes are designed to kill things quickly and without mercy, and in this case those "things" just happen to be other heroes.

We don't anticipate that everyone will like dueling. That's fine. While some players might really love it and find it a cool challenge, we're okay if most people don't make it an integral part of their gaming experience. The system exists to give you the opportunity to obliterate your opponents in an environment designed explicitly for that purpose, but that's it -- and we feel it achieves that goal pretty well.

Now, we're still open to your feedback and will be keeping a close on eye on it throughout the PTR process. We're not opposed to making changes if they benefit the game; in fact, that's what a PTR is all about. In return, we just ask that you keep in mind the scope of what dueling is supposed to be, and that you give the system a fair shot before jumping to conclusions or making sweeping requests for buffs/debuffs/etc. Explore new builds, try out different tactics, and then let us know what you think. If we make changes, we want them to be informed, and that tends to work out best if the feedback you give us is also informed (i.e. not just a judgment based on only a few minutes of gameplay). :)
Posted by: ChuckNorris

why not give a damage reduction for pvp. at least give every class the 30%

Like I said, we're not opposed to making changes, even ones along the lines of a universal damage debuff while in the dueling zone. The point of the PTR is to get feedback from players so we can make those kinds of tuning adjustments if necessary.

We've only got a few hours of feedback at the moment, though, and we'd like to get a better picture of what players' general experience has been before we start talking about possible changes. For example, I'm betting that a lot of players are still dueling in their farming builds, rather than something that's been refined and tailored for PvP-style combat -- which can make a difference. We also want to make sure that the people who are providing feedback understand what dueling is supposed to be (i.e. not a place you go to for super balanced battles).
Posted by: SkiTz

May I ask why on earth did it take 8 months to release such an embarassment of a pvp mode? Seriously, you guys could have given this during the release... It's obvious very little time and effort was put into this system, yet it took this long to give the community such a simple pvp mode?? what a head scratcher.

We didn't spend 8 months on dueling. In fact, we had no plans to add dueling to the game until very recently, and that was both based on the community's consistent feedback as well as our decision to postpone the release of any additional PvP modes. You can read more about that here.
Reducing damage has nothing to do with balance, if damage is reduces for all characters. People just want to be able to fight longer and be able to use a skill more then once.
So a 80% damage reduction should be in order.

Some form of damage reduction is definitely on the table. Before we make any changes, though, we want to watch how players adapt to PvP combat. Dueling has only been available for few days, and we're already seeing new builds and strategies develop -- something which we'll need to consider when evaluating the possibility of blanket damage reduction (or any other tweak that would only affect the dueling world).

Either way, we don't want to compromise PvE gameplay for the sake of balancing dueling. We also don't want to put a lot of restrictions on dueling or create tons of architecture around the system. It's a relatively uncomplicated feature that's there for people take advantage of (if they want), not something that's intended to be regulated or become part of the core gameplay experience. Any changes we make would ultimately be framed by those goals, and it's possible we won't make very many adjustments as a result.

We're loving the feedback we're getting, though -- even the harsh criticisms. Keep it up!

The part that really pisses me off, is I had a thread suggesting they both make a PVP flag for 95% damage reduction vs players(this could be changed to 90% based on testing).
I set this thread up a month ago. They deleted the thread. I suppose, logic was too much of a troll for Blizzard to handle?

You mean this one that's still active?

It was a good read. Thanks for the feedback. :)

The final blue post today is about the amount of effort that goes into updating Diablo III. There is a massive amount of work in the production of a game like Diablo III, and most of it happens out of sight of the players. Vaeflare provides some perspective on the idea of "easy fixes" within the game.
One statement I’ve seen over and over on these forums and elsewhere are proposals for “easy” fixes and overarching assumptions about how long implementation for a variety of changes “should” take.

The reality is, game development is a hugely iterative and time-consuming process, with many people involved along the way. Design takes time, Coding takes time, art takes time, QA takes time: you name it. There are also multiple steps in the pipeline for each and every proposed change and bug fix, no matter how minor, and what issues are being worked on in what order and by who can and do change as new matters arise. Sometimes extra testing is also needed for bugs that come back broken and need to be retested, because we didn't want them to go live with a bad fix.

While there may indeed be a list of known issues and bugs that run alongside some patches, for every one you are aware of, there can be dozens or hundreds being worked on behind-the-scenes that you likely never be aware of. We do things just as quickly as we can, but even then, it’s a process that takes time.
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